Bob: This is FamilyLife Today for Wednesday, December 24th. Our host is the president of FamilyLife, Dennis Rainey, and I'm Bob Lepine. No matter what happens in your life, can you say God is so good, and all His ways are good? Stay tuned.
And welcome to FamilyLife Today, thanks for joining us on the Wednesday edition. I don't know if you've had this tradition at your house but ever since I was a boy, on Christmas Eve, you could pick out one present to open as your night before Christmas present. Did you do that at your house?
Dennis: I actually snuck upstairs where Mom had the presents hidden and opened several.
Bob: But did you get to officially do anything?
Dennis: No.
Bob: See, my parents, they'd let us open a night before Christmas present, but they never put the really good presents under the tree until after we'd gone to bed. So we always got socks or pajamas or something on Christmas Eve.
Dennis: Yeah, yeah.
Bob: Well, we've been allowing our listeners this week to open a – I guess you can't call it night before Christmas – a week before Christmas present.
Dennis: Well, and this is not a second-rate present. In fact, this is one of the best interviews ever, and you and I have been doing a lot interviews since 1992.
Bob: Right.
Dennis: Bob, this is not only the highlight of 2008 for you and me in terms of broadcast, but it's just a great love story.
Bob: Yeah, it is and, in fact, when we first aired this earlier this year, many of our listeners contacted us to order not just a copy for themselves of the CD, which includes the entire interview. We've had to edit it for broadcast purposes.
Dennis: But I went down to the warehouse and said, "Hey, guys, let's find a way to make these things en masse so we can make them available to listeners who would like to give these out en masse to their friends. Now, we're just the day before Christmas and so our warehouse is shut down, and orders are not going to be able to be filled until after the first of the year, and they will be filled on a first-come-first-order basis because last time we did this, wasn't it over 5,000 copies, Bob?
Bob: Yeah, over the course of the next several weeks, we did have thousands of these CDs go out to listeners, so we just want to give you a heads up – if you'd like to receive a single CD or multiple CDs, jut know that it may take us a little bit to get them to you, but we'll get them to you.
Dennis: Right.
Bob: And you can go to our website, which is FamilyLifeToday.com and the information you need is right there on how you can order the CDs.
Dennis: And, of course, the story we're talking about is John and Donna Bishop. John has been an evangelist, a leader in a church, worked with youth, and just a great couple – a couple here from Central Arkansas, and you passed the story on to me, Bob, and Barbara and I listened to it and just wept our way through this story. It really is a great love story of how one wife so served her husband, she brought him back not from the dead but brought him back from a grave illness that he had been through.
Bob: Yeah, back in 1995, John was diagnosed with aseptic meningitis, and a month later he returned to the hospital and this time – and doctors still aren't sure why – but he had lost all of his memory. And as we pick up their story here in part 3 of our conversation with them, we are beginning to get a picture of how John's memory loss…
Dennis: Right.
Bob: … impacted a marriage and a family.
Donna: It was hard on the boys. I think it's probably hardest maybe on my youngest son, because he was 10 years old, and I remember one day Luke came to me, and he said, "Mom, it's not fair, because my brothers had a daddy that got to play ball with them and go hunting with them and do fun things with him," and he caught me on an up day there, so I said, "I know, but you know the Lord's going to let him be special in a different way than he was with your brothers." And so I thank the Lord – my youngest son, he's a good boy, and I thank the Lord, and I think him and his dad are close.
Bob: That had to break your heart, though, for your son to say, "It's not fair. I want a daddy like my brothers had."
Donna: I know. It was – I struggled with the things – I was going to tell you that when – I remember one night John was laying on the couch there, and he said, "It's okay, God, that you let me be sick." Well, when he said that, you know, I said, "Oh, no, it's not okay." Because I just kept saying, "You know, Lord, you know, I married that other man back there, and I just would like to go back to that," and I struggled. That was one of my struggles – the Lord just saying, "Okay, Lord, it's okay." And it was easier for him to say it than for me to say it. I just had a hard time. And so the Lord and I have had many discussions over this.
Bob: Do you feel like you've had two husbands?
Donna: Yes, sir, I sure do.
Dennis: What's the part of John before the illness that you miss the most?
Donna: Probably the part just take the leadership and go on and just the energy just to go on and keep going into things.
Dennis: So he was the leader, he was leading you and the family and the church and taking you in a direction.
Donna: Yes, sir. And he was, you know, just never stopped, just keep going.
Dennis: What's the part of the new John that you like the best?
Donna: I like – the best part is he's very loving, very kind. I guess the Lord slowed him down, and he slows down, and he appreciates things and is just – you know, when we slow down, it's amazing how many things we've learned to miss, you know, that we have missed along the way until we slow down.
Dennis: John, as you hear your wife describe John prior to 1995, prior to the illness, as a man, and you are a man, I mean, you have to be like all the rest of us who want to say, "I want to be that man now."
John: Mm-hm.
Dennis: Do you feel that?
John: Yes, I do, and yet they had some tapes of me preaching before my illness, but one day I listening one of my messages, and I was pretty harsh, and I was listening and "I don't like that guy," and I took tape out and threw it out window.
[laughter]
And I like the new me better. But, you know, my Donna puts it this way, said, before my illness I sort of knock them over the head but now I grab them by the heart. But, you know, I think the Lord just decided if I going to use John, I going to have to break him all the way down and start over. But what I know of me before, and what she telling me and so forth, I like the new me, and things don't bother me maybe like bother other people, because I've been through just so much, and not a whole lot more I could lose, you know? So, okay, that part of it, let's go on, and I have a good time. I tell people I'm a few fries short of a Happy Meal, but I'm happy.
[laughter]
Bob: You know, in circumstances like this, it's not unusual for people to say "Lord, why me? Why is this the path You put me on?" And it's not just the person who goes through the meningitis who asks that, but it's the person who is caring for the person who goes through the meningitis. How have you wrestled with the "Why me?" question, Donna?
Donna: I have wrestled with it, that's, you know, why – you know, I kept telling the Lord, "Lord, we were fine," you know, "we were fine," but the Lord has just showed me, "Donna, I have something special for you," and I have learned so many things through this, and I thank the Lord that He's brought us through this because I love him more, and I love him in a different way, and it's closer, and God is able to use us. And if we're just willing to say, "Okay, Lord, it's all right. Whatever you bring to my life, I know it's for my good."
Every day when I surrender the new thing that, "Okay, Lord, you can have that," and I was just – struggled. I hung onto the back things, I guess, because I could remember them. I hung onto the things in my past, and so – but every time I'd surrender, it was just so much better, and the Lord just eased and gave me so much comfort in knowing that the Lord has a reason for it.
Bob: This is almost an impossible question for you to answer, but if the Lord came to you today and said, "Okay, I'll give you the old John, and we'll start from here with things the way they were, and we'll take away everything of the last 15 years."
Dennis: That's a hard question.
Bob: You can have your choice, what do you want? If you could go back and undo the last 15 years and just kind of be on the path you were on, which is what you longed for at some point, would you pick that, do you think?
Donna: No, sir. I'd take what the Lord has given us, I really would.
Bob: You'd say, "This path has been the right one for me."
Donna: Yes, sir. I think if you'd asked me that a few years ago, I'd probably have said no. But I know that God – this is God's plan for my life, and it's okay.
Dennis: It's back to what John said earlier – "God is good, and He's right."
Donna: Yes, sir.
Dennis: And …
Bob: … blessed be the name of the Lord, right?
Dennis: Yeah, even though it's not been easy, you've begun to experience some of the benefit of the pain that you've been through. Can you share some of those benefits, what they would be?
Donna: It's a closer relationship with the Lord. Also faith – just knowing that God's going to take care of us, regardless of what we go through.
Dennis: Give us an illustration of that. How has He provided for you?
Donna: Oh, He's taken care of everything. I mean, we have more than we need. As far as the physical things, God supplies everything. Every time he goes to the hospital, I think, "Oh, here we go again," you know, but the Lord always takes care of everything, and everything always gets paid, we're never late on bills. God takes care of everything, and also our spiritual – God takes care of us spiritually, too, and gives us courage and strength. And I think one thing that really touches my heart, too, is, you know, when John was in the hospital, you know, he'd just say the name of God, I knew he was praying to the Lord. And, you know, God does – He never leaves us or forsakes us regardless.
And so, you know, John might have forgot everything, and John worked that hard – I couldn't go through those things at the time with him, but the Lord was with him all the way through it. It doesn't matter how hard it gets, He's there. And so how hard it gets on me or whoever, God is there, and we've just got to trust Him.
Dennis: John, do you have anything to add to that?
John: Well, the Lord gives us grace not just endure but enjoy, and, you know, he doesn't just say, "Okay, I'll give you enough grace endure this," there are times of endurance, but most time it's enjoyment. And I get to travel, and I really cannot get to all the places people have invited me. It's just incredible. That's how I met one of your staff. I took my first trip to California by myself, and on airplane. I told my Donna, "I can do it."
Dennis: What's your vision? What is it again?
John: I'm blind, legally blind.
Dennis: But it's 20 what?
John: I don't know the number. I can – one eye I can just make out figures. Like, I can tell you're there, but I wouldn't be able to recognize you. Now, with these goggles that I have under here, I can read if I'm up close, and …
Dennis: So how do you negotiate steps to get on a plane and to travel to California?
John: You know, people are so nice to blind people. If you've got that cane, they get out of your way.
[laughter]
And I just able to make it through, and I called her, and I was there at the place, and I said, "Donna, nobody speaking English here, where am I?"
[laughter]
Dennis: You were in California.
[laughter]
John: She teasing – I was teasing her like I ended up another country or something. But, you know, it's been fun. One time I went and heard a speaker, she went with me, and this man said, "I know some of you out there got skeletons in your closet." Well, I not been taught that yet, and I'm thinking real, and I'm sitting there thinking, "Oh, mercy, if I knew somebody like that, I'd tell on them," you know? And who would do that? You know, and what skeleton is it? And I got home, and I said, "Donna, that man knew people there with skeletons, and he wouldn't tell on them." And she then had to explain to me.
So I am learning all those things, but I do have fun, I do, and the Lord has been – just give me joy as well through the trials and I'm not always laughing, but I love hearing you, because you all laugh a lot, and I love be around happy people.
Bob: John, when you started losing your eyesight eight months ago …
John: Mm-hm, yes.
Bob: You had to think, you know, "Lord, haven't I had enough? I mean, couldn't we just keep the eyes? That would sure be helpful."
John: Yes. Oh, Bob, that was one of the biggest struggles. I should have been able to ace that one after what I've been through, but, I tell you, I struggled. At first I couldn't believe it happening. I thought, "Surely not." Then I thought, "Oh, this just be two or three week, and the Lord say, 'Okay, I just testing you.'" But it went on and on and on. I almost felt like when Abraham was asked to give his son, and I thought of my sight, oh, I remember, I'd tell God, "Okay, Lord, not my will, thine be done," and then I had to tell Him, "I sorry, Lord, I didn't mean it," like I needed to tell Him, but, I mean, I knew I was just saying the words.
Because my ministry been built around telling people that we can trust the Lord with anything, and we can go on. He said, "Rejoice in the Lord always," and I'd lost my joy over this. "Oh, God," I said, "I'm so sorry," and it was just like I raised the knife, and I believe Abraham, when God told him offer son, I think probably at the time God knew he really would do it. He stopped him and said, "Okay," and I finally got a point, "Okay, God, if you want the eyes, too, that is okay. I really do mean it." But that really was a big struggle for me. I should have been stronger, but I wasn't.
Dennis: John, I was told when you were going to come down here that just from an illness standpoint and battling all that you're battling, you might not have the stamina. You've done remarkable.
John: Thank you.
Dennis: I mean, you're hanging in there with Bob's tough questions, and …
Bob: Any headaches? You feeling okay?
John: Yes, I do have headache, and my pain level each day, Bob, is around 5 or 6, between 1 and 10. When it get to 7, I have to medicate it a little bit; 8 and 9 I can live with. If it gets 10, I have to go emergency room. I getting stronger, but I not quite able handle 10.
Bob: So where are you today right now?
John: I about a 7.
Dennis: Wow, wow.
Bob: I don't know many people with a 7 …
Dennis: … who would be doing radio.
Bob: Or smiling or laughing or talking about how good God is.
Dennis: And I think what our listeners don't see is, really, the smile on both their faces.
Donna: That's what I appreciate about him, is he can be hurting so bad, but he still keeps going, and he complains some, yes, but, no, not like I would. I know why the Lord didn't give me the headaches.
Dennis: Not like he could, because of what he's going through.
Donna: No.
John: I try to be good to her. She's been so good to me, and I love her.
Donna: He's very good.
John: I want to make her happy. There are two big goals in my life. Number one, make the Lord happy, number two, make my wife happy, and I love to be able to do that and get her things. When I learned I supposed to love her as much as Christ loved church and gave Himself for – I remember when I heard that, "Wow, that a lot of love. I got to work a whole bunch on this." There is nothing world I wouldn't do for her, and she wouldn't ask me to do something wrong or bad, but I think how good the Lord been to me. He's given me so many things.
Dennis: I know there is one other thing you love to do, too, though.
John: What's that?
Dennis: You love to introduce people to the King of the Universe.
John: Mm-hm.
Dennis: Undoubtedly, there have been those who have heard your story, who don't know Him and who need to. Would you like to take their hand in yours and place it in God's hand, explain to them how they can come into relationship with Jesus Christ and with the Lord God Almighty?"
John: Yes, yes, thank you so much. The Bible says the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance, and if people could just stop, and even if they've been through hard times, difficult times, God in His goodness gave His Son, Jesus, for us, that we might be saved and forgiven and be with Him one day. You see, when I die, all my suffering over. I read in Book of Revelation where John said, "in that city no more pain." And, boy, howdy, am I looking forward to that – no more pain.
The God that wants to give us that place of no more pain is Jesus Christ. He gave His life, He shed His blood. It took a good God to give His Son. It took a good Savior to give His life so that if a person realizes they're a sinner, puts their faith and trust in Jesus Christ, He'll save them the moment they turn to Him. And that's a good God, and I just beg people not turn Him away.
I have had atheists saved, Dennis. I had one atheist get saved, and he said to me, he said, "John, I couldn't argue with you. You just kept saying God good, and he said I finally one day I realize why have I turned down such a good God all these years?" And he gave his life to Christ. I would love to know somebody give their life to Christ. He's a good God.
Dennis: And I would say to that person right now who is listening, why don't you take the offer that God is making on behalf of you? The good God we've talked about who gave His Son, Jesus Christ. You don't have to get down on your knees. You can do it right where you are, driving in a car, listening on an iPod or computer. But if you want to, it would be a good idea to get down on your knees and just surrender your life to Christ. It is the greatest decision you'll ever make.
And, John, I just want to thank you and Donna for telling your story and for allowing us the privilege of – and, Bob, I know you and I have worked together long enough, I know you feel the same – it's just an honor to be in the studio with you. Thank you.
John: It's been an honor for us, too.
Bob: You know, Christmas will be a different day tomorrow if you acknowledge today that the One who came to earth and took on human flesh, the God Man is your Lord and your Master. He is the one you will follow and, Dennis, there's a book that we send out to folks throughout the year called "Pursuing God," that helps them see exactly what it means to be a follower of Jesus Christ, what it means to have a personal relationship with God through Christ, and we'd like to make that book available to anyone here on Christmas Eve who senses God may be tapping on their heart and saying, "Today's the day." You need to bow your knee to Jesus and to trust Him as your Savior, as your Lord, as your Master.
You can call us at 1-800-FLTODAY, 1-800-358-6329, and when you call just say, "I want to be a Christian, and I'd like that book that I heard them talking about on the radio. And, again, we'll be happy to send you a copy of the book "Pursuing God," to help you understand what it means to be a follower of Jesus Christ. The number again, 1-800-FLTODAY. You can also call that number if you're interested in getting copies of the CD that features our interview with John and Donna Bishop. There is part of the conversation on the CD that we were not able to include on air because of our time restrictions, and we'd love to send you the complete interview on CD.
You can request a copy when you call 1-800-FLTODAY, or you can order copies online at FamilyLife.com. We've got a number of folks who have called and ordered multiple copies to share with others, and all the information about how to order the CD in quantity is available online at FamilyLifeToday.com, or you can ask for information when you contact us by phone. And, again, the number is 1-800-F-as-in-family, L-as-in-life, and then the word TODAY.
And, with that, we want to wish you a Merry Christmas. We hope you can be with family and friends tomorrow, and we hope you can tune in for FamilyLife Today. Maybe take a minute out of your Christmas celebration and join us. We're going to spend some time looking at how God announced the birth of Jesus to a group of shepherds on a hillside just outside of Bethlehem more than 2,000 years ago, and I hope you can tune in for that.
I want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, and our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine. Have a Merry Christmas, and we'll see you back tomorrow for another edition of FamilyLife Today.
FamilyLife Today is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas – help for today; hope for tomorrow.
