Bob: This is FamilyLife Today for Monday, April 27th. Our host is the president of FamilyLife, Dennis Rainey, and I'm Bob Lepine. There is nothing more important to communicate to your children than who God is and His plan and purpose for our lives. We'll talk about how you can do that more effectively today. Stay tuned.
And welcome to FamilyLife Today, thanks for joining us on the Monday edition. We are going to talk about teaching our children to better understand God today, but before we do that, I want to remind our listeners that today, tomorrow, Wednesday, and Thursday – those are the last four opportunities you have to take advantage of our special offer that we're making to FamilyLife Today listeners. If you would like to attend one of our upcoming Weekend to Remember Marriage Conferences, and you sign up for one registration at the regular price, we're going to give you a second registration free. So you come and your spouse comes at no cost.
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Now, this probably will not surprise you, Dennis, but when our daughter Amy was still less than two years old, I began teaching her practical theology.
Dennis: How old?
Bob: She was less than two. I used to put her on my lap – in fact, I don't – I think she was still less than a year old, I used to have her on my lap, and she'd be all cute and cuddly, you know …
Dennis: Uh-huh?
Bob: She'd be cooing up and me, and I'd look down at her, and I'd say you know what? You're a wicked sinner – yes, you are; yes, you are; you're a wicked sinner. I was just trying to make sure she understood from the beginning her depraved nature.
Dennis: Now, Bob, there are going to be those who listen to that, and they think, "Why would you want to say something negative?"
Bob: It sounds cruel, doesn't it? But the reality is if she was going to understand who God is, she has to first understand her own desperate condition, and I needed to say it for me, because you look at a new little baby, and all you think is how cute they are and, you know, we fall into this whole idea of thinking these babies are just adorable, and they're so precious, and they're just so good. And the reality is – "in her flesh dwells no good thing."
Well, it does today because she's a follower of Christ, but in those days she was a wicked sinner, yes, she was.
Dennis: We have someone in the studio who – I want to get his response to your story – Dr. Bruce Ware joins us on FamilyLife Today. Bruce, welcome to the broadcast.
Bruce: Thank you, Dennis, it's a pleasure to be here.
Dennis: Bruce is a professor of Christian Theology at Southern Baptist Theological Seminary. He has two daughters, Bethany and Rachel, and has dedicated a book to these young ladies. It is called "Big Truths for Young Hearts," and it's a book about practical theology. Now, is that the way you did it, Bruce? Did you set them on your lap and tell them that they were wicked, wretched, little selfish pieces of humanity?
Bruce: Well, I think Bob was a little more direct than I might have been at two years old, but essentially what he was conveying is what I hope to accomplish in this book and what I taught my own children, too. I mean, boy, to learn your desperate need for grace, especially in a culture where we tend to grow up all around us with affirmations of our goodness; in an entitlement society.
And, my, how important it is to learn how desperate we are, as sinners; how weak and needy we are and how great God is.
Dennis: To that point, there are those who heard Bob's story at the beginning and recoiled at it because what Bob was sharing is really counter-cultural.
Bruce: Absolutely, oh, my. He even is within the Christian environment. As you said, Bob, I mean, you look at these sweet little babies and, of course, we have one now. We have a four-month-old granddaughter, our first, little Ella Rose. She is precious but, boy, inside is – you can tell already – is this sin nature that is ready to be expressed in a variety of ways.
Bob: And there has been this pervasive idea throughout time that babies are born either with the blank tablet, the clean slate, or that they are born fundamentally good, and the culture is what corrupts them. This is why, as parents and with our children, we need to remind ourselves and them about what the Bible says about them.
Bruce: Yes, absolutely.
Bob: I was so thrilled when I saw your book and, in fact, kind of wished I was starting all over again with my own children – you teach Systematic Theology to seminary students to not only master students but doctoral students, and yet what you've done here is you've taken those big truths, and you have made them as simple as possible so that 6 to 14-year-old kids, that's the range you have in mind, right?
Bruce: Yes, right.
Bob: So that they can grab onto – I was looking through the section headings – "God's Word" and "God's Own Life as God," and I thought, well, in a Systematic Theology, you would call that bibliology, right?
Bruce: Right, right.
Bob: And then God is three in one, and there is the doctrine of the Trinity and Creator and Ruler of all. I mean, you've got soteriology, you've got epistemology, you've got all of it in here but in simple language.
Dennis: And to that point, Bruce, what I like about your book is I think it's going to be very healthy and helpful for parents to know what they believe.
Bruce: Well, I hope that's a side benefit of this – is helping parents just understand a bit more fully the range of our beliefs as Christian people that are glorious and wonderful. They breed worship within us, and they cause us to awe and wonder at God, and want to follow Him more faithfully. This has got to be good for parents as well as for the kids.
Bob: And I think if you told the truth while you were writing this book, you had to be thinking, "I'm sneaking a lot of theology to moms and dads who don't know it as well as they should."
Bruce: Well, don't tell them, but the thought did cross my mind, yes, that's true.
Dennis: Well, and, honestly, I think when it comes to the concept of theology, to put the cookies on a lower shelf, ultimately, we're just talking about introducing your child to who God is.
Bruce: Yes.
Dennis: And when we do that, we have to start basically with how has God made Himself known?
Bruce: Right, right.
Dennis: So how would you equip a parent to be able to answer the question if a child did ask – "Well, how has God made Himself known? Who is He? How do we know who He is?"
Bruce: Right, right. Well, one thing I did in the chapter where I began that discussion was just raised the notion of what it is to keep a secret. You know, if you have a secret from somebody, boy, doesn't it just bother you that you can't find out what that is, you know?
And, boy, if God had kept Himself to Himself; if He hadn't actually told us who He is, we would never know. We cannot discover who God is. We are dependent entirely on the fact that He has voluntarily made Himself known to us; revealed Himself both in the created order, the beauty, and the glory and the wonder, the wisdom manifest in Creation and in Christ and in the Scriptures.
And so we see the manifestation of God in these multitude of ways that we are to learn who He is and who we are before Him.
Bob: So you help parents take nature and point children to God by the fact that they can see a tree and a sun and a beach and a mountain and all of that.
Bruce: Right, right.
Bob: And then you help them understand that we know who Jesus is through the Revelation of God's Word, and when we read that, we're really reading Jesus's story, aren't we?
Bruce: Absolutely, yes, that's correct.
Dennis: Okay, let's go back to Bob's illustration with his daughter on his lap, and maybe there are some parents who feel a little uncomfortable beginning with where Bob started, okay, with a declaration of the selfishness of their toddler.
Okay, I understand all that, but where would you coach young parents today to start? Let's say they're raising children who aren't teenagers yet, and maybe they do have some teenagers, and maybe they've not assumed this responsibility as they should have. Where should they start in terms of introducing their children to God?
Bruce: You know, I think the main goal that you have, whether they are little or older is to enable them, by God's grace and through the Revelation of His Word, to catch a vision of the greatness of God. We have – we live in a culture where many other things are great. I mean, we use the word "awesome," of course, for almost everything, maybe even a hamburger, you know, and we've lost the sense of the awesomeness of one – of one and only one of whom there is no equal, and that is our Creator God, our Redeemer God.
And so helping children grow in a way where they realize how great God really is, how independent He is of this world, how privileged it is for me, a finite, feeble human being, to know Him through Christ – what He has done to make Himself known and draw me to Himself.
Dennis: You have dedicated this book to your daughters.
Bruce: Yes.
Dennis: How did you introduce the awesomeness, or the greatness, of God to them when they were little?
Bruce: Well, I'll tell you how this happened – actually, this book grew out of what Jody and I did with our girls growing up. I can remember when Bethany and Rachel were, oh, probably 6 and 3 years old, squirrelly, wiggly, happy little girls who didn't want to go to bed at night, you know?
Dennis: Yeah, we used this technique as well. They'll use anything.
Bruce: Anything.
Dennis: They'll even talk about God to stay awake.
Bruce: So I thought, you know, "If we can't win this battle, let's co-opt it and take advantage of it."
Dennis: Yeah, absolutely.
Bruce: So I started meeting with each of the girls at their bedside after they got in their pajamas and got in bed. I'd get down on my knees, and we'd have Theology 101. For years, I did this, and went through the whole of what I teach at the seminary. But just would introduce a verse and an idea, a truth, and expose them to it, and then we'd talk about it, and they'd ask questions.
Dennis: For instance, what kind?
Bruce: I can remember, with Rachel, boy, I think she was 4 or 5 years old – what I was trying to help her understand the two natures of Christ; that He had to be both God and Man in order for Him to be our Savior; that it wouldn't work if He was only God, and it wouldn't work if He was only Man. The only way He actually could accomplish what we cherish, what our whole eternity is predicated upon; the only way He could do this if He was truly God and Man.
And she struggled with this concept and, you know, so I worked it in illustrations and …
Dennis: By the way, so do I.
Bruce: Yes.
Dennis: Don't you, as a theological professor?
Bruce: Oh, absolutely, absolutely, right.
Dennis: Okay.
Bruce: But, you know, there are some little things that help with this. For example, even to say there is no other person like this …
Dennis: There you go.
Bruce: So don't try to find an analogy out there that is an exact fit; there just won't be, there won't be with the Trinity, there won't be with the two natures of Christ. And so you have to accept this by faith, you have to accept that this is what God tells us of Himself, even if we can't find an analogy out there that is exactly like this.
Bob: You know, two questions here – as you try to explain the two natures of Christ to a 4-year-old or a 5-year-old, I guess the first question is – how many 4-year-olds or 5-year-olds are really paying attention or care or – you know, aren't they thinking about Legos and about whatever they were watching on TV this afternoon?
And then the second question is – can they really get it at age 5 or don't – aren't you just hurting their brain?
Bruce: Right.
[Dennis laughs]
Bruce: You know, on your first question, Bob, I was surprised at how curious little children can be about these things. I mean, goodness, you give them the opportunity, help them understand a few little things, given the opportunity to begin asking questions, and it is just surprising how much comes out of them, how much they are thinking about these things and how interested they are.
And I can remember times when one of my girls would come up in the middle of the day, the next day, and a question would be on their mind from what we had talked about the night before.
And so I really think we underestimate the level of curiosity and the level of ability that children have to think through these things.
Bob: Probably a lot of parents, though, are thinking, "But I'm not Bruce Ware."
Dennis: Yeah. That's what I was just thinking.
Bob: So my daughter is going to come ask me some question, and I'm going to go, "I have no idea." In fact, can we just talk about something else, like Legos, where I do have some understanding?
Bruce: You know, I think what happens often in those cases is we discourage, then, our children from being the curious, probing, thinking people that they could be, because we don't know the answers. We don't know quite what to do with this, and so without really even realizing it, we can shut them down.
And so, instead, I think, I would just encourage parents to respond positively, even if it's to say, "Boy, Johnny, that's a great question. You know, honestly, I don't know that I've thought of quite that before, and I don't know how to answer it right now, but let's do some work on it. Let's talk to some people and read some things and see if we can come up with something on this."
Bob: I remember a dad who came to me one time, and he said, "You know what my son asked me the other night? My son is 8 years old, and he's really bright, and he said, 'Dad, God knew what the devil was going to do, didn't he?' "Well, sure." 'So why did He make him in the first place, if He knew what he was going to do? Doesn't that make God the one who really engineered this whole thing?' And the dad was, like, "I don't know," you know, he was intimidated by that and felt like a failure as a dad because he didn't have a quick answer for his son.
Bruce: Right, right.
Bob: So I guess my question is why did God create Satan in the first place, and then my second question is – yeah, people are going, "I bet you're that dad," no, it was a friend of mine.
But then the second question is – what do you do if you feel intimidated? You said you just say, "Boy, I've never thought about that," but you feel a responsibility – "I better go get the answer."
Bruce: You know, you're the dad, and in Ephesians 6 it says, fathers, in particular – it's interesting, because that passage begins with parents generally – you know, to honor your mother and father, but then Paul speaks specifically to dads, and he said, "Fathers, do not provoke your children to anger but raise them up in the fear and the admonition of the Lord," and one of the ways we do that is by helping them learn who God is, what He has revealed and truths that can shape their worldviews, shape their characters, help them grow up in a way in which they truly think as Christian people from the very outset.
Bob: And there are some things that your kids may ask where you do have to fall back on the secret things belong to the Lord, and we're just never going to know these answers, aren't there?
Bruce: Oh, there are – Deuteronomy 29:29 is that passage, Bob, as you know, and your point is absolutely true. There are many areas where we just have to acknowledge the Revelation of God that doesn't give us an answer to this. And be fair and honest about it, don't begin speculating and begin coming up with all kinds of crazy things when God hasn't told us.
But, on the other hand, the rest of that verse says, "But those things that are revealed are for us, for our children." And so I think we can appeal to the first part of that verse too quickly before we've made sure that, in fact, there is nothing here that's been revealed.
So let's look, let's study Scripture, let's learn what God has told us so that we don't cop out. On the other hand, we don't want to answer presumptuously.
Dennis: We are, in essence, finite creatures.
Bruce: We are.
Dennis: God, by His nature, is infinite and beyond a finite person's understanding. And yet He has revealed enough of the secret of who He is to make Himself known and we, as parents, have a God-given, God-mandated responsibility to teach our children and to introduce our children to Him.
One of the things I like about your book and how it starts, even in the very first chapter that you teach, you begin on a simple level of introducing a child to the greatness of God by looking at a flower and by worshipping God, thinking about all of the detail around a flower. And then you zoom back to the Milky Way galaxy where God created it in a spoken word. And that's where a little child lives.
Bruce: Yes, yes, yes, absolutely. And the more that we can help our children, even visually, picture some of the ways in which God's greatness and glory, His wisdom, His power, is manifest, I think will help them. Even in their own little hearts just begin to cultivate and grow in a sense of the wonder of God. And what an incredible privilege it is to be His creature. Then to realize – back to the beginning of the program, Bob, as a sinner, I don't have rightful access to this God, all of the greatness that is His, I have no right to. I am a sinner and deserve, instead, His condemnation.
So now we talk Gospel and the greatness of this God shown now in His mercy to send His Son and bring forgiveness of sin. So, I mean, the whole package is just glorious, isn't it?
Dennis: It really is, and as you're talking, Bruce, I was thinking of Psalm 127 and how children are a gift from God. And I've said, for many years, here on this broadcast, that we mistakenly think, as parents, that God gave us children to help them grow up. He, in essence, gives us children so we finish the process of growing up ourselves, and I think what your book is doing here, there is no question what your book is doing, because you know what the problem is? And this is why I'm going to challenge each of our listeners to think about getting your book and beginning to go through it, because a lot of our listeners have lost the very thing you were talking about – they have lost the majesty, the glory, and the wonder of God. They have sat in the pew in a church, and they have lost God in the midst of life.
And they are in need of being freshly re-introduced to a God of wonder, majesty, and praise, and then, after you've got the real disease, just a little bit, you don't have to be a theological professor, but after you've just got the disease just a little bit, then pick up your child's hand, even at the age of 2, 3, and 4, and begin to introduce them with just small nuggets to the God who is and the God who is a great redemptive God.
Bob: And, in the meantime, I think there are going to be a lot of moms and dads who are going to learn some things about God themselves, or get some ideas that maybe they've learned before, be refreshed on those things.
Because I was talking to a friend of mine who read through your book as an adult, and she said, "I learned some things, in fact, I had some questions answered that have been bugging me for a long time."
The book we're talking about is "Big Truths for Young Hearts, Teaching and Learning the Greatness of God," by Bruce Ware, and we have it in our FamilyLife Resource Center. In fact, we've got a number of resources designed to help parents with this very important assignment. We have Bruce's book, we've got a storybook for parents to read to their children called "What God Has Always Wanted," that gives them the big picture of redemption in storybook form.
To see the resources we have, go to our website, FamilyLifeToday.com, and there is a list there of resources that are available. You can order from us online, if you'd like. Again, the website if FamilyLifeToday.com or call 1-800-368-6329, 1-800-F-as-in-family, L-as-in-life, and then the word TODAY, and when you get in touch with us, we'll make arrangements to have the resources you need sent to you.
And don't forget – today, tomorrow, Wednesday, and Thursday, the last four days that FamilyLife Today listeners can take advantage of a special offer we're making for you to attend an upcoming Weekend to Remember Marriage Conference. We've got a couple dozen of these conferences still taking place in cities all across the country, and if you register now for the conference and identify yourself as a FamilyLife Today listener, when you pay the regular price for one registration, the second registration is free.
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Now, tomorrow we want to talk more about how we help children understand big concepts, concepts that are hard for grownups to understand – things like the Trinity. We'll talk about that tomorrow. I hope you can be back with us for that.
I want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, and our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine. We'll see you back tomorrow for another edition of FamilyLife Today.
FamilyLife Today is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas – help for today; hope for tomorrow.
