Placed for a Purpose (The Book of Esther): Nana Dolce

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Placed for a Purpose (The Book of Esther)

Guest:Nana Dolce

From the series:Seed of the Woman, Part Two (Day 2 of 4)

Air date:July 16, 2024

Nana: Go to the Father. Whatever you’re facing today, whatever you’re confused by, whatever threatens you, go to the Father. He’s holding up His scepter, and He’s pleased for you to come to His throne.

Shelby: Welcome to FamilyLife Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I’m Shelby Abbott, and your hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson. You can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com.

Ann: This is FamilyLife Today!

Dave: Okay, we’re back, in the middle of a cliff-hanger story—

Ann: —right?!

Dave: —with our guest Nana Dolce, who is a Bible scholar; an expert teacher. We love to hear you teach the word of God. I feel like we could just throw any name and any story and, boom! You’re going to enlighten us. That’s what it feels like.

Ann: [Laughter] Nana, it’s great to have you back.

Nana: Thank you.

Ann: We finished yesterday with the story of Esther. We are right in the middle of it.

Nana: We are.

Ann: Just as a reminder—Nana is a teacher.

Nana: Yes.

Ann: She’s a homeschooler—

Nana: —I am.

Ann: —and you’ve been married for how many years?

Nana: It will be sixteen years on August 2.

Ann: You’re getting some years under your belt in your marriage.

Nana: Yes, we’re getting on. [Laughter]

Ann: Take us back into Esther.

Nana: Yes.

Ann: Why don’t you give us a little summary about what we talked about yesterday and then, let’s keep going in the story.

Nana: Absolutely. We’re in the scariest part of the story. We have this man named Mordecai who takes his cousin as his daughter. She goes into the king’s harem and is chosen to be the queen.

This character named Haman comes almost out of nowhere, but he is instantly an enemy and someone opposing the Jews, because Mordecai is choosing to obey a higher King in not submitting to Haman, in not bowing down to Haman. So, he influences the king to put a command together to destroy every Jewish person—man, woman, child; to destroy their property, from all 127 provinces of the Persion empire.

Ann: This is a genocide of the Jewish people—

Nana: —it is.

Ann: —because he hates them.

Nana: He does.

Ann: And he has no idea that Esther, who is now the queen, is Jewish.

Nana: Yes, yes. In this part of the book [Esther], it says that the Jewish people were weeping and mourning. Mordecai puts on sackcloth and is weeping. Esther hears about it, and she is concerned and sends clothes to him, as if to say, “Change your clothes.” He replies, “My clothes are the least of our worries right now.”

He sends her a copy of the edict so she can read it for herself and gives her a command. Remember, so far, Esther has always obeyed Mordecai.

Ann: Yes.

Nana: He gives her a command to go to the king and “plead for the life of your people.” For the first time in our narrative, Esther hesitates. She’s not quick to obey Mordecai in the way that we’ve seen.

Ann: Why do you think?

Nana: Well, there’s another edict. Remember, Xerxes is this king who is supposed to be so fierce that he puts out these commands that cannot be revoked. You can’t approach his throne room without an invitation.

Ann: Or?

Nana: Or you will die!

Ann: Right.

Nana: The sentence is that you will perish, unless he holds a scepter and pardons you.

So, Esther is reluctant to obey Mordecai who has been like a parent, like a father, to her.

She explains this to him, and he gives a response. He says in Esther 4:13-14—he says this: “Do not think to yourself that in the king’s palace you will escape any more than all the other Jews. For if you keep silent at this time, relief and deliverance will rise for the Jews from another place. But you and your father’s house will perish. And who knows whether you have not come to the kingdom for such a time as this?”

Ann: There it is.

Nana: I love what he says, for a couple of reasons. The first thing is [that] Mordecai is so certain that relief will rise. He’s not saying: “Esther, this depends on you. You have to save us. You have to muster up your courage, and you have to go, because if you don’t the Jewish people will perish.”

Mordecai knows that there is a higher King whose purposes cannot be overcome. Relief will come for the Jews, but, “Esther, what if He has placed you in this position to use you for that purpose?”

Mordecai’s words seem to convince Esther. For the first time in the narrative, instead of him telling Esther to do something, she turns around, and she is asking him to do something. And that something is, “Pray for me.”

Ann: I love this part.

Nana: Yes. “Gather the covenant community, fast and pray for me. Me and my ladies, we will pray as well. I will go, and if I perish, I perish.”

Ann: Whew.

Nana: This is what I want for my daughters.

Ann: Me, too.

Nana: I want my daughters to come to a place where they aren’t obeying Daddy and that they aren’t obeying Mommy just because we’re saying so; but they come to a place where they are so sure of the promises of that higher Father, of that higher King, that even if it means putting themselves at risk or doing something very dangerous and scary, they are willing to do it. That they are actually turning around and saying, “Mommy and Daddy, I have a request for you. Partner with me in prayer. I want to be empowered through prayer to do hard things.”

And the safest place my kids can be is in God’s will and in His providence, in His sovereignty; what He’s planned for them. That’s the safest place. I might think the safest place is keeping them in my house forever. The safest place for Esther—and Mordecai says it: “If you don’t do anything, relief will come, but you and your family will perish.” The safest place was not in her obedience to Xerxes. The safest place was her obedience to that higher King, whose name is never mentioned, and yet, He’s all over this story.

Ann: Yes.

Nana: And Esther realizing that and choosing to obey Him and trust Him is what led, not to her perishing, but to her saving all of the Jewish people.

Ann: Don’t give it away yet!

Nana: Oh, my goodness, I just did, didn’t I? [Laughter]

Dave: So, “If I perish, I perish.” What happened?

Nana: She walks in, after three days of fasting, and it says that he sees her at the entrance, and he is pleased with her, and he extends the scepter. She walks in, and he actually says, “Queen Esther, what do you want? Up to half my kingdom, it will be yours.”

She says, “I want you to come to a banquet, and I want you to bring Haman with you.” Haman is so excited to be invited to this banquet. He goes home and brags to his wife and his friends, and he says, “You know, the only thing getting on my nerves is that Mordecai.” And they say, “Build a gallows, a huge gallows, to hang him on.” So, he does that.

He already has this promise from the king that all the Jews are going to be destroyed, but he can’t even wait for that. He has to build a gallows to hang Mordecai. So, he does so; goes to the banquet. And then, Esther says, “Come back tomorrow for another banquet.” And it’s at this banquet that she reveals herself to be one of the Jewish people.

Ann: Why do you think she didn’t do that at the first banquet?

Nana: You know what? That is an excellent question. I know that Xerxes likes to drink, and when he drinks his emotions come out. I wonder if she wanted one more day before she revealed it.

Ann: Yes.

Nana: I’m not sure. The text doesn’t say, but after they finish drinking (after the second banquet), she reveals herself to be one of the Jewish people and says: “We have an enemy, and this is what he’s done.” The king asks, “Who is this enemy?”

She replies, “This wicked Haman.” The king is enraged; he steps out, and Haman begs for his life. Just as he falls on the cushion where Esther is sitting, the king walks in and says, “Will he even assault the queen in my presence?” And then, someone jumps in and says, “You know he has this gallows that he built for Mordecai, who, by the way, saved your life by identifying some assassins [earlier in the story]. And the king says, “Hang him on that.”

Ann: Whew!

Nana: Haman seems so scary! He plans this genocide, and yet, his plans are frustrated time and time again. And the very gallows he had built, he thought he was building it for Mordecai. He didn’t know he was constructing his own death instrument that day.

Ann: Hmmm.

Nana: He was hung on that. Later on, his ten sons will be killed as well. And Esther does become the one that God has positioned in history “for such a time as this.”

Ann: But I love [that] it wasn’t just Esther that saved her people.

Nana: Yes.

Ann: I keep thinking and going back to the prayer and the fasting of the people. It was like they were one unit together going before God with their voices lifted up and asking, “Father, save us.” But God had placed Esther in that position.

Nana: Yes, yes.

Ann: I wonder what position God has placed you in? Where are you right now? You might feel like He doesn’t see you; He doesn’t know. He does.

Nana: He does.

Ann: And He wants to use you right where you are.

How have you applied this to your life, Nana, as you listen to this story?

Nana: Yes, absolutely. It goes back to being someone who, maybe, sees God as a really mighty King that I can’t just approach. The book that I wrote tells the narratives of women, but my hope is to point to Someone even beyond these women.

There is Someone who is an even better Mediator than Esther. How do we see Jesus in this story? He is the Mediator who chose to approach God’s throne on our behalf. We do not obey that King, that highest King, perfectly and Jesus, the only One who obeys perfectly, goes before Him with all our disobedience.

Esther didn’t perish, but Jesus did. But then He is resurreced to usher us into that throne, not as subjects who have to go trembling and scared, but as children who can walk confidently into the throne room of God.

So, if you are listening, and, maybe, you’ve had what Dave just said, which, certainly, I’ve had that, too. I grew up in a very morally strict household, so even as I thought of Mordecai as raising someone who is very obedient, I obeyed not out of love, but out of fear. I was raised by people who sounded like Xerxes, that big, bad wolf who was huffing and puffing to make me obey, so there was a time when I saw God like that.

In Christ, we have a King that we can walk confidently to His throne. He holds up the scepter, and He is pleased with us because Jesus went before us, and He was struck. He perished for our disobedience and [was] resurrected to usher us without any fear. We can go to Him. We can obey Him out of joy and out of love. He empowers us with His Spirit and enables us to obey and to pray.

So, go to the Father. Whatever you’re facing today, whatever you’re confused by, whatever threatens you, go to the Father. He’s holding up His scepter, and He’s pleased for you to come to His throne.

Dave: Yes, and when we understand that, there is not only a peace, but a confidence that comes in the fact that we understand that we are worthy because He says that we are worthy to approach Him with boldness and grace and to receive that.

And, here’s my point: if we understand that we are worthy and confident, then we can attack moments in our life “for such a time as this.” Because that phrase, obviously, lives on. You wonder in what way the days we are living in right now, personally and individually, God wants to do something great through us like He did through Esther.

In a sense, we are like Esther. “This is my moment. I can change a legacy. I can approach a situation and say, ‘This is right. This is wrong.’ We have to take action.

As a pastor, I can lead a community of people to a greater vision and impact the world. It’s now!”

Ann: Yes. I’m thinking, too, of parents; of the impact you are having on your kids. I think about you, Nana. Have you read this book with your girls?

Nana: Yes. My wonderful husband has a hope that we will read through the Bible at least three times by the time our eldest is eighteen.

Ann: Wow. Great goal.

Nana: So, we’ve read all through the Old Testament, all the New Testament, and then we’ve circled back again. So, we’ve read the book of Esther together.

Ann: And what about this book that you’ve written about the women of the Bible. Are they intrigued by the women?

Nana: Yes, they are. One of the things I mentioned the last time I was here was my ten-year-old asking why the Bible seems to be about men. I guess she didn’t hear enough sermons or enough teaching about the women in Scripture, so she said, “This seems to be mainly about men.”

So, yes, I taught this to the young women at our church, but I also wanted my own little women to see that, “No, the Bible is about men and women that God uses, ultimately, to tell the biggest story about His Son.”

Dave: Do you two women ever feel like you are an “Esther?” Have you ever had moments in your life where you’ve thought, “I think God is calling me, like He did Esther, ‘for such a time as this?” In whatever area, whether it’s where you live, in your family, it’s in your legacy, as a mom, as a wife?

I’m just throwing it out there. I’m just wondering.

Nana: Yes. The thing that comes to my mind is—I hinted a little bit about this earlier: I grew up in a household that sometimes felt scary. There were moments when I felt I had to walk on eggshells and say just the right thing and do just the right thing. I was very obedient, but my obedience was out of fear.

There are places where I see that with Esther a little bit. She’s obeying, but there’s this fear of doing the right thing, “I want to obey Mordecai. I want to obey Xerxes.” When we come to this point in the narrative where she is willing to do something even if she perishes, she prays and she says, “I will do this hard thing, trusting in God. I will obey you, Mordecai, but ultimately my obedience is in the Lord Himself.”

I want to be an Esther in that way. I want to be a woman who doesn’t make decisions out of fear, who doesn’t make cultural decisions; because even in our culture we live in today, it can be easy to say the wrong thing to the wrong person in the wrong way.

Dave: Right.

Nana: There can be a lot of wrath that comes your way. It can be courageous to say, “I’m going to say this truth because Scripture says it, and I’m going to say it out of love, and I’m going to say it out of gentleness, fearing a higher King, or fearing the higher authority; being in His pleasure over people-pleasing.

So, more and more and more, I want to be a woman who obeys God and who makes decisions not out of fear of men, whether it’s people in my family or people in the community, but out of a greater fear of God.

Ann: I think I have felt that, raising our boys. I remember hearing a woman say to me: “Isn’t it amazing to think that God chose you to raise these three kids?”

I remember feeling, “I am so inept. I don’t have what it takes. I don’t have the spiritual background. My family—we weren’t believers growing up.” And this woman said to me, “And yet, He still chose you because there is something in you that your children need. The parts of you that He wants to give away are going to be gifts that you give to them. Only you can give those things.”

I remember, I felt this excitement and fear. I felt this responsibility to disciple them, to love them, to nurture them, and push them towards Jesus. I felt this: “Woah! I have something in me with the gospel and with Jesus. In discipleship, I can pass that along. And my prayer was always: “Father, would You use them to mark and change their generation for You?”

So, now, as they are grown men and doing some amazing things for Jesus, honestly— which is only through prayer, I feel like; now, I have that same kind of burden for women. I want women to understand the greatness, the power, the influence they carry. It changes a home. It changes a marriage. It changes a community. It changes the world.

I feel like there is a battle going on over us, because Satan does not want us to live out our God-given identity and our calling in our lives. Whether we are single, married, kids, or no kids, God has something so great for you! It might not be the “great” that our culture says is great. It could be serving in a capacity [where] nobody sees you. And yet, when you are surrendered to the King of Kings, you are changing your world for Jesus in the way He has made you to do that.

But I think women feel: “God can’t use me.” And I would just say, “He can use you! He wants to use you.”

I look at Esther and think, “Here is this little girl, who was an orphan!” We aren’t sure why and how she became an orphan, but I bet she thought many times, “I bet God can’t use me.” He used her and her community to save an entire people group, the Jewish people. So, I guess I do feel that a little bit. [Laughter]

Dave: I knew that fire was going to come out.

Here’s the last thing I would add, at least for you is, as I think about you and your family: you were the Esther of the Barron legacy. Even the fact that, as a young woman—Nana, you don’t know this, but her dad is a very—he’s passed now, but he was my high school coach, and he’s a patriarch. He is a strong man.

Ann: A self-made man.

Dave: A self-made man who had his way, and the family obeyed and lived under that. Not a tyrant, a loving man, but there was no—

Ann: —no spiritual—

Dave: —no flexibility. So, when Ann and I started dating, and we got on our knees and got engaged to say, “We’re praying that God uses us to lead their whole family to Christ,” (because they weren’t followers), it was this woman that went to—

Ann: —and my sister.

Dave: Yes, but really, you, on fire, went to your dad and said, “Dad, you will perish without Jesus.”

Nana: Wow.

Dave: He didn’t want to hear that. Yet, thirty years later, the whole family are followers of Christ.

Nana: Praise God!

Dave: Because an Esther, like Ann—you had the Esther strength to say, “For such a time as this. This is the time, this is the moment. This either happens, or it doesn’t.”

Your dad could have said, “I don’t want you in my house anymore if you are going to talk like that.” And there were times where he did say, “I don’t want to hear that.”

Ann: Well, before any of you think, “Wow, she’s amazing,” I just want you to know I came into my house as a nineteen-year-old saying, “We’re all going to hell unless we don’t have Jesus!” So, I may not have done it at the beginning in the most attractive, palatable kind of way, but I think later on they saw my zeal and my love for Jesus; and yours, too, Dave. You really did help.

Dave: Yes, and maybe a listener today is thinking, “Maybe God wants to use me as an Esther in my family legacy. Maybe I’m the one—He can use my life, my actions, my voice, and change the course of history.”

Shelby: A beautiful story there, that you might be thinking is beyond you and your family; but, no, if you’re a follower of Christ, if you’re a Christian, the Spirit who raised Jesus from the dead is the same Spirit who lives within you. And with Him, anything is possible; anything is!

I loved hearing that great endcap today to our time. I want you to know that God can work in your family the same way. He can work in you the same way.

I’m Shelby Abbott, and you’ve been listening to Dave and Ann Wilson with Nana Dolce on FamilyLife Today. If you enjoyed the conversation or the one you heard yesterday with Nana, and, maybe, you want to learn more about God’s loving control over all things, over everything, you can get this content in a unique and special format. Nana and Dave and Ann have some exciting news for you.

Nana: I’m so glad that our discussion today is going to be packaged in an email series that will go out to listeners.

Dave: Yes, and on video.

Ann: This is a pretty exciting deal!

Dave: Yes, I don’t know if we’ve ever done this. You can go to FamilyLifeToday.com, and you can find the link in the show notes, and you can watch it.

Ann: And you’re going to have questions. This is an opportunity we are giving you to dive deeper into this series on “Making Sense of the Unexpected.”

Shelby: So, again, you can sign up for the email series—a four-week video series—with Nana Dolce. Head over to FamilyLifeToday.com, or you can find it in the show notes.

I wanted to make sure that you know to stay tuned for Day 3 of Nana Dolce coming up tomorrow in our special series with her, and make sure you go back and listen to the past episodes with Nana Dolce, talking about The Seed of the Woman. You’ll find it all in the show notes section on FamilyLife Today.com.

She’s written a book called The Seed of the Woman: Thirty Narratives That Point to Jesus. This book that she has written is going to be our gift to you when you give to FamilyLife Today. You can get your copy right now with any donation by going online and giving at FamilyLifeToday.com and clicking on the “Donate Now” button at the top of the page. Or you can give us a call with your donation at 800-358-6329; again, that number is 800-“F” as in family, “L” as in life, and then the word, “TODAY.”

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Have you ever wondered how God could turn bitterness into redemption? Maybe you are someone who struggles with bitterness yourself, and you’re wondering: “How could God ever redeem this?” Well, tomorrow, Nana Dolce is back to talk about Naomi’s story, in the book of Ruth, as she went from bitterness to redemption. That’s coming up tomorrow. We hope you’ll join us.

On behalf of Dave and Ann Wilson, I’m Shelby Abbott. We will see you back next time for another edition of FamilyLife Today.

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