How to Find Peace (When You Don’t Know Where to Look): Jeremiah Johnston

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How to Find Peace (When You Don’t Know Where to Look)

Guest:Jeremiah Johnston

From the series:Unleashing Peace (Day 2 of 2)

Air date:February 25, 2025

Jeremiah: Panic is as dangerous as any other pathogen. We live in a crisis of panic right now. There has been a 51 percent increase in in-patient hospitalizations among youth, age 12-18; the majority of those are females. We know there is an anxiety crisis in our country. We know that this is also, I think, the most important question the church can answer—we have the answer for anxiety—it’s shalom; it’s Jesus. We need to help people get there and then live in it.

Ann: Welcome to FamilyLife Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I’m Ann Wilson.

Dave: And I’m Dave Wilson, and you can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com. This is FamilyLife Today!

Dave: I developed sort of a bad habit during the pandemic.

Ann: You wore sweatpants every day?

Dave: That was part of it;—

Ann: That’s what I did.

Dave: —every meeting was on Zoom.

No, it was: I literally started waking up, grabbing my phone—and instead of opening to the Word of God, which has been a practice of mine for decades—I found myself going to the news—

Ann: I did the same thing.

Dave: —like first thing,—

Ann: Yes, because—

Dave: —like New York Times: “What are the latest numbers? What is happening around the world? What is the pandemic doing in Michigan?” I would be anxious; I would be scared. I would be like, “Oh my goodness! It’s worse than—how can it get worse?!” It kept getting worse and worse.

I just/it hit me, two or three weeks in, like, “What are you doing? You are filling your mind with negativity, and you are starting the day nervous and scared.” I thought, “I need to start with the Word of God.” I’m not saying, “Never look at the news, not know what is going on in the world,” but I literally had to discipline myself: “Don’t reach for that phone. You can find out later what you need to know.”

Ann: We had to turn off notifications because they’d pop up; and you’re like, “What?” Then you get sucked into the world of fear is what I would say.

Dave: Yes, I think fear and anxiety is rampant. It’s always been a struggle; but right now, even sort of post-pandemic, it’s still with us. We need to talk about it.

Jeremiah: Absolutely.

Dave: We’ve got Jeremiah Johnston back in the studio with us. Welcome back.

Jeremiah: It’s so great to be here. Thank you. Love you guys; it’s awesome to be here.

Dave: I mean, we spent a day already talking a little bit about—I love the title of your book—Unleashing Peace. By the way, did you come up with that title?

Jeremiah: I did.

Dave: Because it’s descriptive—“I want to unleash it,”—Experiencing God’s Shalom in Your Pursuit of Happiness.

You mentioned yesterday you went through a valley. I want to hear more about that valley, because I’m guessing there was a little anxiety in that valley.

Jeremiah: Absolutely.

Dave: How did you find God’s peace in the middle of that?

Jeremiah: Yes; you know, anxiety comes when we have large transitions in our life—major transitions—a move, a transfer, a ministry change, health challenge—

Ann: —babies

Jeremiah: —babies, triplets.

Dave: —triplets.

Jeremiah: You know, I have been just blowing and going, running and gunning, my whole life, just loving the Lord and following Him—and just hit a wall at the pandemic—where I ended up having a major unplanned abdominal surgery, where I had to have a piece of my colon cut out, after 400 workouts; best shape of my life. No one could explain to me why this was happening; I was angry.

In the midst of this, we had major events—kind of like Cru—we plan our events months, sometimes, years out—and to have those just cancelled, one after another—that’s what I’m called to do: to help people replicate Christian thinking.

Dave: I mean, some of that had to be financial.

Jeremiah: Oh, yes, significant; absolutely.

Dave: That’s how you live: is you speak.

Jeremiah: Absolutely. Praise God, we’re a debt-free ministry—but we have to cash flow the ministry, and we have to actually do ministry—it was so challenging and all those reasons. It began to affect me mentally, where I would just/was living in anxiety and not living in the peace of God.

I always joke with people now: “You know, the worst thing you can do, if you want the peace of God, is to write a book on it.” [Laughter] It took me a minute to really allow these truths to permeate my life at the most practical levels.

Ann: Also,—

Jeremiah: Yes?

Ann: —you are married; and you have five kids.

Jeremiah: —who are watching me every day, listening to me every day, emulating my moods. They see all the non-verbal signals that we give.

It was challenging, and I realized I didn’t have a care team. I realized I needed to talk to professionals. I realized that I needed to help people manage—and also, I’m sorry—they don’t give you a manual. You can have two seminary degrees and a PhD, but they don’t tell you how to handle, when God is just opening all kinds of opportunities, how to regulate that, and be a dad, and be a husband, and to do it with success. I’m not going to leave my family behind in my ministry; I’m going to say, “No,” for anything that gets in the way of that.

I was just stuck! Have you ever been there?

Dave: Oh, yeah.

Jeremiah: I was stuck! I saw a Christian psychologist, who was life-changing to me. He

helped me really start thinking about how I was thinking and how I was processing

things. That’s where so much of the truth of this book—I know it works, because it

works in my own life—the Word of God.

But we need to have a care team; we need to establish peace for ourselves. Like you said—such a practical thing—not beginning the day in fear and panic. It turns out that panic is as dangerous as any other pathogen, and we live in a crisis of panic right now. There has been a 51 percent increase in in-patient hospitalizations this year among youth, age 12-18; and the majority of those are females.

I’m not a Christian boogeyman or anything—I don’t always have to have a boogeyman in the room—but we should pay attention to the metrics. We know there is an anxiety crisis in our country. We know this is also, I think, the most important question the church can answer—that’s why I start the book this way—”We have the answer for anxiety: it’s shalom; it’s Jesus. We need to help people get there and then live in it.”

Having lived in it through my own life, and then developing this peace plan—and you all, I want to tell you what I did; this is what comes out of writing a book, 70,000 words on the peace of God—1 page, 20 steps of how I live in the peace of God for my life. These are the non-negotiables. I don’t do these with perfection; but again, I’ve eliminated “all or nothing” thinking from my life—it’s not “all or nothing” thinking—the Christian life isn’t “all or nothing”: “Oh, I messed up today; so I’m just not going to live for the Lord anymore,”—no! But so many of us have that “all or nothing” thinking, and that brings anxiety as well.

My number one—are you ready for this, Dave?—

Dave: Practical Ways to Implement Shalom: I want to hear it.

Jeremiah: “Stop obsessively checking the news.” [Laughter]

Ann: There you go!—yes.

Dave: You just wrote that five minutes ago; that was your number one?

Jeremiah: Listen, that was my number one, because our minds are not geared to read

a body count every single day. Now, that doesn’t mean we don’t care. But again, our

minds are not wired to just be inundated with the murder number, the body count, the

pathogen they’re playing every single day.

Ann: Jeremiah, talk about this too—because you have five kids—we have a lot of

listeners who have kids who are teenagers; and they have that phone with them, and

they are constantly checking that. As parents—as your kids are getting older—how will

you help navigate that?

Jeremiah: Well, first off, it’s the greatest conflict in our personal home. I totally understand that: the devices. I talked about this, as I was writing Unleashing Peace; because even before the pandemic, psychologists can’t quantify the damage that all these devices are doing on young people. And that was before the pandemic, where we sent devices home with everyone; and they were on them all day just because they had to be to have education, which was a total failure, in and of itself. Long story, short; they already knew it was a problem.

And so first off, I get it. I live in that tension with five kids and devices. We have to limit

these things in our kids’ lives—again, I’m preaching to the choir; you guys have done

great programs on managing social media and all these devices—we have to because

that is a source that is so toxic, especially, for our young women. Eating disorders are

the most fatal—of all mental illnesses—are eating disorders. People don’t realize that’s

the most fatal.

So stopping to check the news;

not doom-scrolling;

not contributing to the panic—Number 3.

Ann: What’s that mean?

Jeremiah: I’m going to be less provokable in my Christian life. There is an entire industry out there, Ann—and you know this—they are betting on the fact that they can click bait you to death, and they can get you to engage in all kinds of fights with people you don’t even know on social media—they don’t know you; you don’t know them—and you’re just/it’s just the rage machine.

We’re not going to live in the peace of God, Dave, if we’re just constantly living in I’m-provoked City over everything. I’m an expert in late antiquity. The Roman Empire was way worse than it was today. Paul could have been provoked by everything every time he opened his eyes; he stayed central to the gospel of Jesus Christ. That is why I love FamilyLife Today—central to the gospel and its power to change lives—that’s why it is such an honor to be on this program with you guys.

Dave: I’ve even found, in reference to that, I can get caught up in the comment section.

Jeremiah: Yes; absolutely.

Dave: Somebody posts something—and it might be sort of just mild—but then, the

comments go crazy; and that’s where I start scrolling.

Jeremiah: Exactly; exactly.

Dave: It’s almost like you’re watching a car wreck.

Ann: And then, he’ll say, “Ann! Look at this. Come over here, and look at this!”

Dave: And it’s like, “What am I doing?” So that’s a great one:—

Jeremiah: And it’s just an offramp.

Dave: — “Stop doom-scrolling.”

Jeremiah: “Stop doom-scrolling.”

Dave: “Don’t contribute—

Ann: —”to the panic.”

Dave: Number (4) is a big one: “Stay social.”

Jeremiah: “Stay social.” And this was where I was so affected. And the worst

punishment psychologists will tell us for human beings is isolation. So if you’re

isolated—that’s the worst; you think about solitary confinement—so stay social.

“Establish a daily schedule.”

We got to rise and grind. We got to have that schedule in our life.

“Leave the house.”

You could sit in that Content Chair all day long, [seven] days a week, and just die.

So get out of the house, like, “Go to Costco.”

Ann: Even kids: sometimes, we have to push them out of the house.

Jeremiah: Exactly; yeah.

“Get off the devices.”

“Get out into nature.” I need more beauty in my life.

“Exercise”; huge. The cheapest therapy we can do every day is exercise for the benefits we get mentally for it.

And then, 10-20 really get practical: “Start thanking God more for what He’s done instead of always worrying about what comes next.”

Dave: Now, when you were walking through that valley, was worry a big part of it?

Jeremiah: Absolutely—not knowing—we had just taken a major step of faith in 2019 and expand as a ministry.

Dave: —right before the pandemic.

Jeremiah: It was incredible—greatest year of ministry—and then, it’s like the floor fell out and being isolated.

Ann: I’m thinking too—our listeners know this—Jeremiah came into our studio; he goes

in and meets everybody. He’s sitting in our sound booth, and he’s talking to everybody.

He’s like everybody’s best friend. You are an incredible extrovert—love people—so this

isolation—

Jeremiah: Oh, I was dying. I had never experienced it. I’ve been involved in church life for as long as I can remember—and I just love it—this whole thing of: “Stay home,” “Don’t talk to your neighbors,” “Don’t…”—it was killing me.

Number 11 was huge: “Look at art more.” We need more beauty in our life. Arthur [F.]

Holmes, that great Wheaton professor, said, “All truth is God’s truth.” I’m not going to

find a single bit of truth that doesn’t drive us right back to the God of the Bible,

because all truth is God’s truth; and we need more beauty.

“To have quiet time prayer in any sleepless moments, lying in bed.” And then, if I fall

asleep while I’m praying, just consider that a gift from God. Just turn those worries into

prayers.

Here’s a really practical one: “Use Scripture Typer.” I don’t know if you all have seen this

app to memorize Scripture, but it’s called Scripture Typer. A friend of mine

recommended it to me. It’s just a great way to practice memorizing Scripture. The Word

of God—the sword of the Spirit is the Word of God—and huge for us. When stress or

anxiety fills my mind—Ann, you brought this up—I need to replace it with key verses;

that is how I’m going to have shalom in my life. There’s no way around that in the

Christian life. We just have to stop right there. There’s not a secret sauce that you guys

know, or just a few Delta Force Christians like you; we all have to do the same thing,

don’t we?

Ann: I love the language that is used in Scripture, too: “Take every thought captive…”; when Jesus said, “I came to set the captive free.” I think of taking those thoughts—and I’m taking them and putting them in a cell—and I will not let them out. Learning how to do that, for me, has been huge: “I’m not going to think that”; and to use Scripture in replacing that—

Jeremiah: —huge.

Ann: —transforms our lives.

Jeremiah: It literally will rewire—we don’t have time to go into neuroplasticity—it will rewire the way you think; I can attest to that in my own life.

Dave: Here is another one—I know you even put in your book—1 Peter 5: “Cast all your anxiety”—

Jeremiah: —violently out there.

Dave: I literally think of—I preached; as a preacher—I got to get the fishing line out and

cast “Worry”; and had a guy in the audience put on ”Peace,” coming back. But I found—

and I think it’s for all of our realities—you got to do that over, and over, and over.

Jeremiah: —all day; maybe, 5,000 times today.

Dave: It doesn’t happen once.

Jeremiah: The force of the language is even more than “casting”—I like J.B. Phillips [version]—“You’ve got to slam dunk your worries on God. You’ve just got to crush them down on God.” That is what He wants you to do—trust me—He can take it.

Dave: That’s good.

Jeremiah: I want to talk about this saying, “Thank You, Jesus” throughout the day.

Dave: Yeah; what’s that?

Jeremiah: And again, a lot of people have been talking about this. I’ve been talking about it since 2015. A great barometer of our mental health is our ability to experience gratitude. It’s amazing when we do something the Bible tells us to do—count our blessings—we’re a lot happier when we focus on the blessings, the positives in our life.

Yale University’s most popular class of all time is a class on happiness, and the big outcome of that class is a gratitude journal. Well, the Scripture has been telling us to do that for 2,000 years. They can call it a gratitude journal today at Yale; the Bible calls it “counting your blessings.” You’re a lot healthier person when you focus on the blessings in your life. We’ve all been around people and benefitted from people—they just focus on the positive—don’t you love being around people like that?

Ann: Yes.

Jeremiah: We can’t stand the Negative Nellie, who is always in the room, and reminding us of what we can’t do, didn’t do, [what] didn’t happen.

Ann: Ehhhhh-eh!

Jeremiah: We don’t want that. And the Bible doesn’t want us to live that.

Dave: But it’s so easy to do:—

Jeremiah: Totally; it is.

Dave: —complain. We all got things to complain about. You’re saying, “Get out of that valley.”

Jeremiah: —say, “Thank You, Jesus,” throughout the day.

Ann: Last week, I ended up going on a walk. A lot of times, I’ll listen to podcasts/I’ll listen to Scripture. So this time, I left my phone at home—went for a long walk—and as I was walking and praying—again, outdoors; it was beautiful, out in Florida—looking at nature, I thought, “Lord, for this entire time, all I’m going to do is thank You and praise You.”

Jeremiah: Yes; that’s so powerful.

Ann: I was crying by the end. Because when you think through what God has done and the goodness—and it’s not that there aren’t bad or hard things—but when you think about God’s goodness, or maybe just little things, and you say them out loud—that’s why I was in tears; I was praying out loud—I wasn’t around anybody. But man, my heart was filled with joy. It was filled with peace that surpasses—and I love that Scripture—it surpasses all understanding.

Jeremiah: Absolutely; that’s huge. And for those of you who are joining us: I’m

reviewing my personal peace steps. I would encourage people to develop their own.

Like Ann, that’s a beautiful analogy.

Here’s point (16). I want you to listen closely to this one: “There are things only God can

control and things He allows me to take part in controlling.” I try and discern which are

which and only work to resolve the things He allows me to help control.

Ann: Ohhhh! I am bad at this one.

Jeremiah: We could do a whole show on that, because I’m a control freak. I live and

die by my schedule—traveling, writing, speaking—I want to control everything. And

man, there’s things God doesn’t need my help with. Jeremiah Johnston thinks he’s

God’s Chief of Staff; did you know that? I do; I want to help God control things in my life,

and I just can’t do that if I’m going to live in the peace of God.

Dave: How do you navigate—

Ann: —discerning.

Dave: —that, as a dad?

Jeremiah: I don’t know if I do it very well. But I will tell you this: we have a very open

dialogue in our family. Our kids know they can talk to us about anything. Our kids also

know that nothing changes our love for them. No decision they could ever make would

change their value in our eyes or the love that we have for them.

Dave: Have they experienced much anxiety?

Jeremiah: Our son, Justin, has. The mask-wearing just crushed him, emotionally, and

also the change in schedule. He’s kind of like his dad—a very schedule-oriented guy—

and he just didn’t understand. And yet, we broke free of that; praise God; and again,

through talking.

I’ll just mention this—I know y’all have done so many helpful programs—kids don’t walk

up, and say, “Hey Dave, I’m having a panic attack.” They say they have constant

headaches, or they have constant stomach aches. Those are the two big signs. I’m not

a psychologist; but if you have a child, who is regularly complaining of headaches

and/or stomach aches, you should probably have a professional work with you—a

Christian counselor; a Christian therapist—help you with your child; because they’re

saying more than that. So again, huge on that one.

A true sabbatical is huge—a time of rest to do what feeds my soul; resting my mind—

not thinking about the next sermon.

Dave: The Sabbath rest is something, I think, we just don’t think is that important; it’s a Ten Commandment.

Jeremiah: It is; and it is part of shalom. God says: “Rest, chill out, relax, do something fun.”

Dave: So in your crazy busy schedule, do you Sabbath?

Jeremiah: Absolutely; we have a lot of fun Sabbath-ing too.

Dave: What’s that look like?

Jeremiah: Sabbath isn’t boring; it’s fun.

Ann: —but even when you Sabbath—you’re Sabbath-ing—but I like what you said; you’re not thinking about—

Jeremiah: —the next: “Oh, yeah…”

This goes into the next point about being able to say, “No.” We can’t Sabbath—and check our phones 2,000 times that day—and be present with our family. So we have to have those moments—and they are holy moments—where you just say, “No, I’m not available; sorry. I’m going to be with my kids today. I’m going to go and have a blast, and make weird noises, and have a fun time with them.”

Dave: In some ways, you’re Sabbath-ing, down here in Orlando.

Jeremiah: Absolutely. Thank you again, guys, for encouraging your guests to bring their families with them. First off, it’s great to expose them to a place like this. I know they are taking that in, verbally and non-verbally.

But to get down here and just have fun and travel. I’m a big travel narrator when we travel—I am pointing things out—I’m a travel guide in the car. So they kind of get worn out with that.

Big one for me—and again, as the Lord blesses you, wherever you are in life—and you’re going to have opportunities. It doesn’t mean you have to say, “Yes,” to everything. Now, no one gave us Christian Thinkers; I joke, “We became our ministry before we even knew we had one.” There was a time in my life I said, “Yes,” to everything; because I’m just trying to be faithful and see our ministry grow.

Ann: I have a husband, who can say that too.

Jeremiah: Yeah; but I had to learn:—

Dave: —say what?

Ann: —say, “Yes,” to everything. [Laughter]

Jeremiah:

I had to learn the power of saying, “No, I’m sorry; I can’t do that.”

I realized I had 11 different inboxes; I had to start telling people, “I don’t respond to this inbox; text me or email me”; I just didn’t have time.

“Don’t make decisions when I’m tired or discouraged,”—this is a real challenging one, because I was in a season of months of discouragement—and you have to make decisions at some point in that time period.

I was in a funk; that is where—like we talked about—having that care team was so helpful; because sometimes, you need people to come alongside and help you think right, and just say, “You know, Jeremiah, you are not processing this the right way.” This is where I just thank God for this teaching of shalom, because it’s all right there; we just need to do it. We need to have a shalom team/a care team.

And then, (20) was huge for me. I have a doctor—I travel with all kinds of supplements,

and nutritional habits in eating—just taking care of our physical temples will help us

think better. And so again, we’re talking about my personal 20 steps. I needed 20; you,

Ann, might only need 2.

Ann: I might need 50!

Jeremiah: You exude the peace of God.

These are things that are so important. And then, when I live in the peace of God, I then can be an agent of peace for others. This will set you apart in your Christian life.

There is this amazing story I tell in Unleashing Peace of a gentleman—who was just given the highest award/civilian honor that the nation of Australia gives—a man they call the Angel of the Gap. He lived in this beautiful Sydney Harbor, in a very expensive area called the Gap; but it’s also known for its sandstone cliffs. It’s one of the number-one suicide spots in the world. For 50 years, Don Ritchie lived there. He sold kitchen appliances and just was a salesman. He was part of the greatest generation—World War II vet—decorated.

He began to notice when people would linger just a little too long by themselves at the Gap/at the cliffside. He would walk up, and say, “Hey, do you want to come to my house for some tea? I’m Don.” At his funeral, recently—it’s documented—his son said, “My dad saved over 400 lives from suicide.” One of the people he saved later painted a canvas, sent it to him, and said, “Thank you. You’re the Angel of the Gap.” Literally, they said, “An Angel walked among us.” Don did not have a single credential with mental health; he wasn’t trained psychologically, but he could practice what the Bible talks about: the ministry of being present. He said, “Don’t ever underestimate the power of a smile in someone’s life.”

My biggest challenge is: we are so busy; we never know what someone else is dealing with—and we always assume negatively—that person could be going through their biggest challenge. Why don’t you just smile at them, and practice the ministry of presence, and give them grace? Don exemplifies that for us. That’s why I wanted to highlight that powerful story. So when I live in these 20 steps, I can be like a Don Ritchie—I can practice the peace of God—because some people need to see it on us to believe that they can actually get there.

Ann: That was one of my favorite parts of your book—is that story—because it makes you realize: “Anybody can minister to another person, just by being there.” You don’t even have to have the right words—

Jeremiah: No, you don’t even have to say anything.

Ann: —but you’re just present, “Hey, I’m Ann. How are you doing today?” That’s something that—you’re right, Jeremiah—is we get so caught up in our own worlds and the demands of life. It’s really easy not to notice those around us.

Dave: And I think another aspect of that story is—all around us—are people walking toward that bridge.

Jeremiah: Exactly; exactly.

Dave: It’s not, literally, a bridge; but they are struggling; they are feeling—it could even be our own kids; it could be our spouse—

Jeremiah: Absolutely.

Dave: —God is saying, “I can bring My peace to them through you. Will you just be present?” That’s a beautiful motivation—

Jeremiah: Yes!—the ministry of presence.

Dave: —to say, “If God gives me peace, it’s probably not just for me; He wants me to extend it to others.”

Jeremiah: Absolutely; He wants you to be an agent of shalom.

I’ll just end with this: we all need to be saved from ourselves too. I used to live in the UK, where I did my doctoral residency at Oxford; and there is this beautiful picture of a young man, who has all of these individuals holding him. He is standing outside of the walkway of a bridge, over the busiest intersection in North London, Golders Green. He was getting ready to jump—and all these strangers, who were walking by him, collapsed on the man—and saved him from himself. You don’t think God’s providential? Someone had a rope, going home from work that day; another person is grabbing his belt buckle; another person has him by his calf muscles.

For me, when I saw that picture—I now show it anywhere I speak; I open the book, Unleashing Peace, with that story—because it is an illustrated sermon for me: “We have to be saved from ourselves.” This is the heart of Jesus towards every person struggling right now; and God can use anyone—like you said, Ann—to be a change agent in someone’s life, a peace agent, a shalom agent. So that’s my prayer—I want to be present enough in my life to see when those people—or myself, when I need to be saved from myself, I allow people to collapse around me and help me. That’s the Christian life.

Ann: Hey guys, we just wanted to take a quick minute to jump in and say, “Whatever

you’re going through today, I think this is important to remember: ‘You aren’t alone.’”

And did you know that Dave and I have a team at FamilyLife Today ready to pray for

you? It’s this incredible honor and a privilege to lift your name up to God. So if you need

prayer, please don’t hesitate to reach out to us; I really mean that. Head on over to

FamilyLife.com/PrayForMe. Again, that’s FamilyLife.com/PrayForMe; and tell us how we

can pray. And again, we are not kidding: Dave and I have a prayer team specifically

dedicated to praying for our listeners. And I pray for some of these while I’m on my

walks with God; I just pray. I will pray for you. And Dave, you always fast on Fridays;

and that’s when you pray.

Dave: Yeah, I take the whole day—and instead of eating food—I’m praying: I’m praying

for my family, but I’m also praying for you and your family. Isn’t that a great thing to

know that someone’s praying for you? And if it’s not, Ann and I praying for you,

someone from our small prayer team will pray for you by name. We love to do it, so go

to FamilyLife.com/PrayForMe and submit your requests. Do it right now; we would love

to pray for you today.

Dave: When Jeremiah was talking about peace—a lack of anxiety and worry—if there is anything our world needs right now, that’s it; isn’t it?

Ann: We all long for it, but we don’t know how to attain it.

Dave: Yes, and one of the things we briefly touched on with Jeremiah—and it is in his book, Unleashing Peace—is my go-to passage, Philippians 4.

Ann: It’s all of our go-to passage; all of us love this one.

Dave: I love how Paul says/he says: “Do not be anxious about anything.” It’s a command; it isn’t a suggestion. He is actually saying: “This possible. You don’t have to worry; you don’t have to fret. You don’t have to be anxious about the big things/little things—about anything.”

Ann: Here is the thing about Paul, too—is you read that—some people think, “Well, you can say that; look how easy your life is,”—but Paul, for a good part of his life, he spent it in prison!

Dave: Yes, he’s writing this from a prison cell.

Ann: —in prison, yes.

Dave: I think, as Jeremiah said, it comes down to an action, which is in this passage that I had never really seen—because he doesn’t just say, “Don’t be anxious about anything,”—that’s what we don’t do; but he says: “Do this…” He gives you an answer: “But in every situation”—so again: big ones, little ones, the one you are in right now, the one that is coming tomorrow; here is what you do—“by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God.” There is an action step: Pray about it.” Petition means “Make a list if you have to. Literally, get out your journal, and say, ‘God, this is what I’m struggling with…’—’I don’t know if I can pay the mortgage,’—‘My son is battling a medical condition,’—‘I don’t know the future,’—whatever it is; thank God He is with you in it and present those [to Him]. In other words, “Let it go.” We talked about

1 Peter: “Cast it to God”; and then, he says something will happen. What does he say?

Ann: “The peace of God, which surpasses all understanding,—

Dave: —”will guard your hearts and minds in Christ Jesus.” So if you want peace, there is a way. I would say it is not a way; it is a Person—

Ann: Well, it is interesting—

Dave: —peace is Jesus.

Ann: —because of all the people that I know—I would say you live this out.

Dave: What are you talking about? You don’t know what’s swirling around in my brain.

Ann: Let me just say this; it was interesting: we just had one of our sons visit us in Florida. You were ahead of us on your motorcycle. This son—

Dave: Because I couldn’t fit in the car with the grandkids. I had to ride my motorcycle everywhere we went.

Ann: This son looked at you, ahead of us, on your motorcycle; and he said—he’s in ministry; he is building a ministry—and he said, “Man, I needed this trip, because I needed”—[emotion in voice] makes me teary thinking about it—“I need to get some lessons from my dad, because he lives his life in peace.” There is so much going on in the world, and his ministry, and a lot of hard things; and yet, he looks at you—and you’ve gone through some really difficult things—but you live your life in peace. It’s a peace that surpasses all understanding, because it doesn’t make sense.

I feel like, as you are preaching that, you live this. Do you think—like share with us, because I’ve seen you live it out beautifully, not perfectly—”How do you do it?”

Dave: Well, I think it is the next verse—which is what Jeremiah Johnston, when he was talking and when I read his book, connected that there is an action verb that connects us to peace—and he calls it: “It is our thinking.” It’s what Paul went on to say in verse 8. Often, we stop with verse 7—you know, “The peace that surpasses all understanding will guard our hearts and minds in Christ,”—we’re like, “Oh, that is awesome”; and we forget the next thing he said—it is not a separate thought; it is in context—he says, “Finally, brothers and sisters, whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable, if anything is excellent or praiseworthy”—here is the verb—“think about such things.”

I think one of the things I take away from today’s interview was: peace comes through

what we dwell on: “What do we think about?” Paul is saying, “Think about good things,

pure things, right things.”

Ann: That is so wise. I sit there and think, “That’s denial; we need to think about

reality.” And reality is harsh, and reality’s hitting us head-on. And so it can feel like: “No,

Paul’s saying, ‘Don’t think about those things”—not that we’re not dealing with life and

we’re in denial—but I feel like you’ve done that.

Dave: Well, I would just say it is war—it is a battle/the battle of the mind—because your mind will go to the negative. It will go to the news that’s often negative; and you’ll get scared, anxious, worried. I’ve done it millions of times.

Ann: Me too.

Dave: I’m sitting here, thinking, “You think I have peace all the time?!” It’s like it’s a war—it is, literally, a mental battle in my mind—and everyone’s mind—to say, “I’m going to take this negative thought captive.” I literally think of grabbing it—and putting it in a prison cell—and saying, “You’re not going to live in my brain. I’m going to think about what’s noble, and right, and praiseworthy; I’m going to think about Jesus,”—because peace isn’t a feeling—it’s a person; peace is Jesus—He is the Prince of Peace. When you set your heart and mind, and it is guarded by Him, the result is peace.

Again, I’m not going to sit here, and say, “Oh, it’s just peace that lasts forever,”—no, it’s gone in like five minutes sometimes. Again, you have to cast, again, that thought—

Ann: I like that idea of casting.

Dave: —you just throw it.

Ann: Yes, you can see it [anxiety/worry] on a fishing pole, casting it.

Dave: And I love how Jeremiah brought the sense that the verb is like with force. You don’t sort of flippantly, “Okay, God”—no; it’s like—“I need You so badly. I’m bringing this to You right here, right now. Will You guard my heart and mind in You?” He is like, “Yes; I’ve got it.”

You may have to cast it 5,000 times today—every time your mind starts to go to anxiety—“Don’t worry about anything with prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God.” Why do I have that memorized?—because I’ve done it a million times—and that is where peace is. It’s in the person, Jesus; and the closer we walk with Him, the greater the depth of the peace we feel.

Ann: Well, I don’t know if you’ve done this; but I have often woken up in the middle of

the night with my mind racing. Instantly, fear-based: “What could happen to our kids?”—

“our grandkids?”—”our future?” There’s so many different things that have kept me

awake at night. Even when they were teenagers, especially, that’s when I was waking

up the most.

Dave: I didn’t worry about the kids. I just worried about the car insurance to pay for.

Ann: That’s so true; we’re so different that way. But even now, if I wake up, I feel like

now what I’m starting to do, I’ll do that casting. I’m so visual; I have to visually see

Jesus in front of me. I’ve shared this before: I take the thing that’s weighing me down of

creating so much worry and anxiety, and I picture myself handing it to Jesus. And then, I

see myself standing free—“He sets the captive free,”—I’m not carrying it; I’ve given it to

Him, because He says, “Come to Me, all of you who are weary and heavy laden, and I

will give you—

Dave: —“rest.”

Ann: —”rest.” I picture Him taking it. And then, I’ll ask this question: “Jesus, is there

anything I need to do?” And if something pops into my mind, it could be—usually,

there’s nothing—to me, He’s saying, “Rest.” But that’s been a really good visual practice

of my casting. I have to visually see myself handing it to Him. But that’s hard to do. It’s

hard to not just go back, and back, and back, and try to carry it ourselves.

Dave: Well, I’m hoping, just as a result of our conversation, a listener today says, “You

know what? I’m not going to carry this any longer. I am going to let it go to the Prince of

Peace. I’m going to pray and thank Him for my life, and I’m going to trust Him; and I’m

going to trust that He’ll bring peace as well. And every time my mind goes somewhere

else, I’m going to keep that thought captive and allow Him to change my thinking, which

will change my peace.” I hope couples do this together—

Ann: Me, too.

Dave: —that a husband and wife will do it together.

Ann: Will you just read it one last time—that “Think about these things”—what are the

things we’re to think about?

Dave: “Finally, brothers”—and sisters—”whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is

right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable; if anything is excellent

or praiseworthy, think about such things.”

Ann: That’s really good.

Dave: And even says this: “Whatever you have learned, or received, or heard from me,

or seen in me, put it into practice. And the God of peace will be with you.”

Ann: Absolutely; that is so true.

And hey, for you, the listener, if you want to dive more into this topic, go to

FamilyLifeToday.com. Check out this episode’s show notes; we’ve got a link to

Jeremiah Johnston’s book, Unleashing Peace.

And let me just add: if you know anyone who needs to hear conversations like this one,

we’d love it if you would just share today’s specific conversation from wherever you get

your podcasts. And while you’re there, just a simple way that you can help more people

discover God’s plan for families is by leaving a rating and a review for FamilyLife Today.

We would really appreciate it if you do that.

Dave: We’re Dave and Ann Wilson, and we will see you back next time for another

edition of FamilyLife Today.

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